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View Full Version : Non - Hit Taking & Cheating / R.I.F.T. Standards



Tony
5th March 2013, 08:55 AM
Hi guys and girls :)

As many of you may know that I and the R.I.F.T. Staff are particular about the standards of several key factors when running a R.I.F.T. Airsoft Day;


Game play:
1.) Safety.
2.) Honest Players.
3.) Balanced Teams.
4.) Props/Non boring Scenario's.

R.I.F.T. Services:
1.) Friendly Warm Atmosphere.
2.) Helpful / Useful Staff.
3.) Value For Money
4.) On Site assistance and facilities.
5.) Quality Experience.

Obviously we have certain control over many areas as listed above..... some we have little or no control over.

The reason for this thread is to address, discuss and make aware of certain issues that can make a day at R.I.F.T. Airsoft a pleasurable experience for EVERYONE involved.

Lets start at the top - I would like feedback and any criticism regarding your experience as a player at R.I.F.T. Airsoft.

Game play:

1.) Safety.
All Marshal's carry First Aid Kits and are First Aid Trained. We have Mobiles for 999 calls and are all linked via Radio to one another. The Safety Brief explains what to do in case of certain issues on site. Tripping hazards, site boundaries and rules are fully explained.


2.) Honest Players.
During the Morning Brief I take several minutes to address the importance of HONEST GAMEPLAY. I stress that the only way to have an enjoyable day is to play honestly.
After all - the guy shooting at you is LOOKING AT YOU!
If in doubt - call it out.... not a long walk to or from your Dead Zone....

The Third of March had 101 players on site.
Before this game we have only had a few small comments regarding hit taking.
During this game I received some of the worst feedback regarding Hit Taking - something I was very unhappy about.

Would you say that too many players creates more cheating?
Is it not possible to have 100+ Honest Players?
Is it the New Players or do the experienced guys sometimes "forget" to call HIT?
Do you see the BB's bounce off the enemy player or are you assuming you "must" be hitting them?
Do you call for a Marshal?
Are you 100% Honest - ALL of the time?
Does your pride override your decision to take or NOT take a HIT?
Are you happy to name and shame an Obvious Cheat and have him removed permanently from every R.I.F.T. Airsoft event?
What thoughts have you got to overcome this problem?

We all know that cheating of any kind will ruin the experience for other players AND unbalance the flow of the battle.

I pledge, with the strong community at R.I.F.T. Airsoft to stamp out ALL cheating at ALL times.
If we work together and communicate - we will have a strong, honest player base and maximum enjoyment from the sport we love!


3.) Balanced Teams.
One frustrating thing for any player is to be thrown onto a Team with all the guys and girls that might not be as experienced OR not local to our site....
I try to encourage players to stick with their own Team Mates and friends but this can come at a cost and can lead to an in balance....
I do, see how the first main Scenario plays out and talk to both Teams and ask if they are happy and suggest a swap around if needed.

What do you guys think?

4.) Props/Non boring Scenario's.
R.I.F.T. is still rather new and is growing at an amazing rate (thanks to you guys) and I never want to stand still where props and new game scenarios are concerned.
We will be investing for the future; usable vehicles,pyrotechnic, realistic half buildings & structures, 2 story kill house, rooftop MG Emplacement, Towers, new camping area and lots more as time goes on!
I never want you to feel bored or pushed into certain roles that you are uncomfortable with.
Semi - complicated through to easy, just kill the bad guys approach....


Any thoughts?

**We have new systems in place to SPEED UP the game turn around**

R.I.F.T. Services:

1.) Friendly Warm Atmosphere.
Done and dusted! I am so PROUD of all the guys and girls that come to visit!
If we are any more friendlier we would all have to move in together! :p

2.) Helpful / Useful Staff.
All R.I.F.T. Staff and Marshal's have their roles and are experienced Airsoft Players themselves.
This does not make them perfect OR mean they know more than you! We strive to give you the best experience as we can and we are there to serve you for the day.
We try not to interfere out in the game area and are there when you need us. We are only human, can't possibly see everything all of the time or be everywhere at once!
We will help anyone, with anything and always adopt a professional approach to all situations.
You will never be shot at or grenade killed by a R.I.F.T. Marshal that wants to interfere.
If we get in the way - SHOUT at us to move!

What are your experiences with R.I.F.T. Marshal's?

3.) Value For Money
Running Sites is a very costly exercise indeed! We will always strive to give you guys the best value for money we can - but we are always re-investing in the land and props!
I put discounts in place for new players, run "bring a buddy" 5 off promotions and we offer a great Membership package with HUGE discounts on ammo and accessories!

R.I.F.T. also offers a FREE UKARA service (no you do NOT have to join as a Member to be UKARA registered) we will do that for you with no charge whatsoever! All you need to do is meet the criteria of playing 3 times in no less than two months OR prove your UKARA status is up for renewal and R.I.F.T. can get you re-registered!


4.) On Site assistance and facilities.
We spent months making our set up area as useful as possible! The 40 Metre target range is due for an upgrade to 60, 70 & 80 Metre targets (yes, just for the ASPUK Snipers!!) We have a First Aid room, Armoury, battery charging facility, light gun repair and lots more!

Is there anything you feel we need to add?

5.) Quality Experience.
Well - only you can answer that!
I see lots of laughter and smiles between games and receive lots of very kind emails, PM's and texts thanking us for a great time.... It makes me very happy but I know that we must always keep pushing forward to do better!

Thoughts?


Sorry for the wall of text - took me 5 days to write :p
Please take your time to read through and reply whenever you can.

All feedback and constructive criticism welcome.

Together we will make it as good as it can ever be.

Thank you.

Maverick
5th March 2013, 01:41 PM
Hit taking

Ok hit taking is the ugly side to our sport / hobbie some people come to play the game dead serious while others for fun most somewhere in between.
I do have a problem with people kicking up a stink at the END of there day.
This helps no one ! If you have a problem get it sorted tell a marshel speak to the person face to face
By speaking out at end of day does nothing but puts a downer on the day as so much effort has been applied to the event, this means the culprit will go on through out the day doing it over and over again (this might still be a honest mistake ) you will never no until its handled

At Finmere they have introduced a number system each player has a tag with there own number so it's eases the problem in finding "that guy over there marshel in the camo " :/ problem

Number will be taken and one of the marshel team sits on them and see if it is a case of non hit taking OR the bbs are falling short / coming off a backpack etc etc that they can't feel

Then a yellow card given as everyone needs the benifit of the doubt as it never 100% cut and shut case


Lewis

GBBR_man
5th March 2013, 01:44 PM
You make some very interesting points here Tony and id like to reply to some of them with my thoughts:
Safety - Cant fault it, it is so nice to see more than one first aid trained marshall. I often carry my first aid kit at other sites where they only have one or two first aiders. I dont need to do that here.

Honesty - You will always get cheaters, that happens and its not always the young guns and the rentals. I do think with 100+ players on site it was going to be bigger than normal, ive been to events with over 300 people playing and ther cheat calling goes up with the numbers. My only thoughts here are make it known what channels the marshalls are on so those of us with radios can call for the marshall quicker - maybe have two channels, one for marshall to marshall chat and one for player to marshall. I for one called for a marshall in the second game Sunday and it took a good while for the marshalls to realise i was calling. I dont think we are all hoest 100% of the time but its not about the odd mistake, its the persistant cheaters i dislike. As for naming and shaming persistant cheats yes i will name and shame if i can id them but with so many people wearing the same few camo types and carrying M4s / G36 it is hard. You do take a proactive attitude towards cheatting and that is refreshing to see.

Balanced teams - This is a hard one. Often the bigger groups are experianced players who are a team thus want to play together. This can be hard to break up i agree. What we do here i dont know? The other bigger groups tend to be rentals and they often come together and i think should be offered the chance to split up. I also think you know who are the experianced players who know the site and maybe rather than asking be more firm when you need people to change teams, i for one would be happy to.

Props / non boring scenarios - Cant fault you here. I loved the Drugs game but maybe next time have the drugs in more locations. I look forward to seing what new games you have up your sleeve. Id like to see more use of some of the other buildings on site, espesialy the one down at the old blue respawn that we can now use. How about the one up by the skip? I look forward to the expansion, that will bring a new twist to the site.

Speeding up the games etc - I still feel we spend to long before going out for the game breif. It was advertised 9:15 and im sorry to say i was expecting to be heading to the parade ground at 9:15. I think the time between games is just right but not before the first game.

Freindly warm atmosphere - After 9 months to have 100+ players on site and having to turn away a big team says it all. We all like the way you run the site and the freindlyness of it. I do feel being a family buisness it helps to. Its nice to see the scream team getting involved (even when they do demonstrate why they are called that) and full credit to them for getting stuck in. One of them got me with a nice shot to the hand sunday in the conservatory, im not sure who it was but well played whoever it was.

Helpfull staff - Cant fault you. You are a top bunch and it is so nice to see a team working together from the same page so yu are all equal. It is so nice to see you willing to help out the experianced players as well as the new guys. Keep it up please. As you have found as well it works both ways, we help you out to as you help us out.

Value for money - Cant fault it. You do your best and we all apreciate it. Your lucky to have good contacts to get the deals and we apreciate it.

On site assitance and facilities - Nice safe zone but i realy hope you have sorted the toilet in the portacabin out. Maybe for weekenders look at getting a portaloo again. One question though, have you got water on site? Or is it only bottled water. I know of a couple of sites who dont have running water but the owners bring a couple of big jerry can style containers of water along.

Quality experiance - Brilliant, attendance Sunday should say it all to you. I know of many sites that after 9 years of running struggle to see 100+ players ever let alone so quickly.

GarfyB
5th March 2013, 05:57 PM
Game play:
1.) Safety. As good as it ever could be!
2.) Honest Players. Over the years I've worked out that the number of cheats are proportionate to the number of players. More players = more cheats! The only way round this is to have the proportionate amount of marshals and to boot the cheats off site like you say you would do. Perhaps when there are large numbers use designated player marshals?
From what I saw the marshals were spot on, on Sunday, but they can't be everywhere, all of the time.
Having said that, the players I saw not taking hits behaved themselves whenever a marshal was close by. There is no easy answer other than be vigilant, which all you marshals are. And I do think the non-hit taking was blown out of proportion by a certain few, if I was to be honest.
3.) Balanced Teams. Generally, yes, but when they're not, they're tweaked - No problem!
4.) Props/Non boring Scenario's. All good!

R.I.F.T. Services:
1.) Friendly Warm Atmosphere. Definitely!
2.) Helpful / Useful Staff. Absolutely!
3.) Value For Money Most definitely!
4.) On Site assistance and facilities. Superb!
5.) Quality Experience. Yet to have a bad one!

Cold-War-Charlie
5th March 2013, 07:09 PM
Game play is excellent with some of the best scenarios I have played at Airsoft. The teams seem balanced and I don't think the numbers were excessive although the higher number could have benefited with a couple more marshals. (its all proportionate)

With regards to Hit tasking I agree with the above it cannot be tied down to any type of player. I think sometimes the Adrenaline and Testosterone gets going and it blurs some peoples judgement. I am of the view that I will keep sending BB's their way and maybe one will sink in and register (it does hurt after all).

Safety is excellent and I feel a lot more confident that RIFT can handle an injury etc than some other sites I have visited.

The staff are excellent and make a point of talking to everyone in a friendly and courteous manner and are fair.

I think the price is pitched perfectly especially if you have family members who attend as some sites are prohibitive due to high costs.

I think the key word is excellent and I have been recommending RIFT to friends.

jono the giant
7th March 2013, 07:22 PM
I enjoy the performance of all staff and the politeness of all of them! especially the little boss man! :D
The players are great and honest when Ive shot players i always give them a 2 second waiting period due i know the bb's would have hit them in that time and i wait for a response and everyone who i hit had called there hits even though there are always cheaters.
I hope when i play again in a week and a bits time that all players live up to the standard of taking hits - I for one did not realize i got hit at one time and Rambo was behind cover with me and told me i was hit.
I did not hesitate to stand up and walk to the designated dead zone.
The combined efforts and the staff and players are the reason why i have wanted to take part in the sport of airsoft at cottenham until it sadly see's its last game and every penny on membership will not be wasted.
I will come to every game because i have found such a polite and welcoming community.
When my name got called out to receive my Shield i knew they weren't clapping because i had just become an member of the rift community, I had become part of a honest gaming community.
I am expected to be the best playing role for the community and my teammates and also my friends
**by the way because bane was telling me about the strawberries being packed with fibre bane has taken some money out of his bank account when he hit the stock exchange in gotham city and said give these to the players at rift :L so there will be a box or two of fresh strawberries with a help yourself sign on them**
Also Tony big big big amount of spending money on the 17th! people will soon know why i said on the introduce yourself forum i love my pyro! :D new toy is coming along with me too can you put down on the booking i just need a hire aeg you know the 15 one
My new toy is a Bolt action to snipe and scout at the back with binocs :D but also going up and close with the aeg.

KarlosX
7th March 2013, 10:15 PM
I was surprised to see the comments regards hit taking as this has not been an issue until this game. From day one, even back to the days when the games were invite only, RIFT has always, always, been pro-active in stamping out cheating and not acquiring the stigma that some sites seem to get labeled with! There are blatant cheats out there, fact! These individuals not only spoil people's gaming days but create long lasting upset, all which is totally unnecessary. Without a shadow of a doubt, if anyone is caught deliberately not taking their hits, new players or old hands, the staff will instantly ban them.
On the flip side it is all too easy to call someone a cheat because you "think" you are hitting them, please be sure to call a Marshall if in doubt.

Fenboy
7th March 2013, 11:28 PM
Where do I start!!

Garfy has pretty much summed up my thoughts but, here is my 2p worth:

Well, I have been playing Airsoft (airsoftiiiiing!!:p) for almost eight years and can honestly say that no other site that I have been to, can offer the same experience as you get at R.I.F.T. From the game scenarios, friendly atmosphere, food (nom nom), membership, marshalling, players, event photos, continual site improvements, general facilities, banter, it does not get any better than this!

I used to play regularly at another local site to me but, things got a bit stale, had some 'clicky' groups, cheating and having two kids and being made redundant did not help things either.... So I had a bit of a holiday from Airsoft.

I found the R.I.F.T forum in the spring of last year and realising that it was just 15 mins away, I managed to get my first game in July (I think?!?!??). I have been to one other new site since, just the once. I pretty much signed up as a R.I.F.T member straight away as I think it's a great idea. Say no more, I'm hooked/RIFTified!!

I have had a couple minor incidents with hit taking bit that's it. No real blatant cheating as sometimes you can not feel the hits (we are humans wearing all manor of different load outs after all!!). Incidents have been dealt with quickly. I have also seen a couple safety issues that I have brought to Tony's attention and measures gave been put into place. Saying that, it's up to the players to be safe at the end of the day (or even at the start of the day when you test fire your weapon at a fence pole and a BB ricochets back into the car park where you fired it from and hits my car or, you discharge a BB from your bolt action in the safe zone - two different days/people....). Come on people!

A couple of things if like to see:

Better parking at Cottenham.
Compulsory Chronoing of all guns.
Maybe each player is issued with a number? (I'll bagsy 100 please!) regulars could keep same number and get Velcro patch of something, maybe use membership numbers. I have seen this at other sites but, just for rental players...

R.I.F.T is a breath of fresh air in the Airsoft scene and I think bigger things are only just around the corner :cool:.

I would like to take this opportunity to thank Tony and his team, and you guys and girls for making R.I.F.T what it is today - AWESOME!!

Matt

**EDIT - if the above seems a bit garbled, it was the end of a long two days, very tired, tiny phone text and fat fingers....:o

Matty12
10th April 2013, 11:50 AM
I agree with every comment here. Ive only been to 1 airsoft game but sure was it a good one! All the marshalls were friendly and so were the players. I didnt have a problem with non hit taking which was very good. I really liked how the more expireanced players got the younger and least expireanced players involved in the games and got them to help out instead of leaving them out to pretty much watch. After all the politeness was brilliant and I will definatly be coming again due to all of that!!!

Maverick
11th April 2013, 09:11 AM
Just to add

Always know the performance of your gun,

For new comers or softers who have just brought a new gun ..
It's always a good idea to put the gun in a trusted friends hands and get them to shoot at you at distance you will see how far the bbs are travelling.. We're there dropping off short ... And if there just reaching hitting you at there limit ... Think to yourself would I have felt/heard that in the middle of the action with the adrenaline pumping ?

Maybe the benefit of doubt might be given

Just a suggestion but one that might surprise some players when they give it a go

Lewis

Topcat
11th April 2013, 08:18 PM
Thanks Lewis

thats a pretty cool way to gauge a persons weapon..

Terry (Marshal)

Joey1307
31st August 2013, 01:43 PM
My Opinion:

R.I.F.T. Services:

1.) Friendly Warm Atmosphere.
Absolutely, Everyone was very polite, during breaks and on the field. :)
2.) Helpful / Useful Staff.
Again, absolutely, every question I asked (and there was alot of them :o) was answered (Thanks Tony!)
3.) Value For Money.
You bet, everything included in Full Hire for 45? Very well worth it :D (And I liked the fact it was 5 off the first game)
4.) On Site assistance and facilities.
Yes, assistance and facilities were fine :P
5.) Quality Experience.
Definitely. It was my first ever game on the 25th (and it sure won't be my last) and it was excellent, I'm very happy I chose R.I.F.T. Airsoft, and I will definitely be playing again! :cool:

~ Joe